North Korea's stance against America exposes the lies of the rulers of the Muslim world

[Mujahid]

All along the rulers of the Muslim world have maintained that they are too weak to confront the might of America. Recently, King Abdullah of Jordan summed up the mood of the rulers when he said that a miracle was needed to avert the war on Iraq. However, the apparent weakness of America to confront the belligerent manoeuvres undertaken by North Korea has shattered these claims.



Increasingly, Muslims are realising that the rulers have been deceiving the Ummah about the real strength of her enemies. In addition, the rulers have repeatedly understated the abilities of the Muslim armies to confront the armies of the kafir powers and their surrogates like Israel and India. Incidents like the Kargil conflict; Israel's inability to crush the brave Muslims of Palestine and America's failed attempts to control Afghanistan demonstrate the limitations of the kafir armies and the strength of the Muslim Ummah. What would happen if the rulers withdrew all assistance to the enemies of this Ummah and sent the Muslim armies to confront their colonialism instead of unarmed civilians or poorly armed groups?



Indeed, powerful Muslim countries like Egypt, Turkey, Iran and Pakistan together with oil rich Gulf States are more than enough to expel the crusaders and their partners from Muslim lands. What is required is a leadership that is sincere to Islam and the Muslim Ummah.



Allah (Subhanahu Wa Ta'aala) says



‘So do not become weak (against your enemy), nor be sad, and you will be superior (in victory) if you are indeed (true) believers’ [TMQ 3: 139].



Muslim must demand the rulers to confront colonialism. If they refuse, Muslims must call upon the people of power to remove these corrupt rulers and establish a sincere leader in their place, who will unify the Muslim armies under a single banner and use them to expel the crusaders and their partners from Muslim lands.

[old_n_grumpy]

The mighty Muslim armies you speak of crumbled when confronted by the Israelis, why would they fare better against the US?

Do you sincerely think that the IDF is trying to crush the Palestinians?

Why would King Abdullah, or any sane person for that matter, stick his neck out to support Saddam Hussein?

[Panoramic]

Mujahid while I understand that most muslims who will be willing to form an army will have the advantage over their enemies and that is they are out there to Die.

from what I know Israelies value this Life because they believe its the only life.
where as muslims share the christians views that this life leads to the Eternal life.

I However can not compare North Korea to any Arab country.

yes we maybe able to face America or any other country but the leaders also weigh the suffering as a result of any signs of hostility against the Americans. i.e are we willing to sacrifice?

problem is not all muslims think the same way you do. many are happy with what they have now and they are happy to live like this.

if I went into history youll realise that Arab Muslim leaders always depended on others to help them.
other muslims ofcourse.
but non Arabs.
thats why we had the "mamlokees" for example.
so most probably we lost that confidence long ago ... even B4 we are born our history says we need others to help us. (my view on this may be limited )

[muslim]

North Korea's stance against America exposes the lies of the rulers of the Muslim world..... <font color="blue"> And exposes the myth of the superpower called as America.Today N. Korea has dared , in future many others would do. The days of American hagemoney seem numbered now with many other such development in Europe, Africa (remeber Nelson Mandela's sppech?)and Asia. <!--color-->[/color]

[Schutzstaffel]

I think the only reason Israel has 'failed' to thwart anything is because for whatever reason they're not unleashing the full might of her military. With respect to N. Korea, do you seriously believe that their belligerence for lack of a better term, exposes anything other than their desperation to obtain oil and food? You people are really only fooling yourselves. You really have absolutely NO idea what America is capable of unleashing against other nations. You cite Afghanistan as an example of how America can't control other nations. All I can say to you is this, she has been very, very restrained with her might and selective on what and who she has targeted. You really just have no idea.

[theman]

if american "might" is shown by their ability to elect a competent and intelligent leader like Dubya, then i have to say they are the mightiest in the world.

the will of people with a cause is mightier than anything the US wishes it could muster.

i do agree that currently the US military is the most advanced technologically but they are not invincible.

I don't know if the US would be able to defend itself like it should given its capability against an attack on the mainland. Its such a shame that the US federal government was created with the primary responsibility to provide a defense against outside aggressors. It would be unfortunate if Canada or Mexico lets say goes berzerk and invades US, while most of its troops are stationed overseas.
UT can you give us a breakdown of US troop deployment both domestic and international?

The titanic was once thought of as an unsinkable ship.

if the US continues in this course of violence and injustice people in the future will be saying "Remember when some people thought that the US was invincible"

[MoonBeam]

"if the US continues in this course of violence and injustice people in the future will be saying "Remember when some people thought that the US was invincible"

I give the good ole US another 500-800 years before the possibility of her collapsing like the Roman empire. Sure is a long time to piss and moan about her and all of her injustices. <img src="/threads/images/graemlins/devil.gif" alt="" />

[Brasco]

"All I can say to you is this, she has been very, very restrained with her might and selective on what and who she has targeted. You really just have no idea."

Many members here talk about how we "have no idea" about US military might and what the US could do if she really wanted to etc.

I think I can safely say that everyone understands the military might of the US. With a budget of $400 bn to spend on defense, everyone knows that the US could obliterate the world many times over. Moreover, she's demonstrated what she can do many times in the past 70 years or so for all the world to see. We all know that the US is the undisputed, supreme military power of all time. So what is the point that is being made by you?

Should the US nuke Afghanistan to really assert her authority and make sure everyone has a "better idea" of what she is capable of? Or make sure we all know who's boss by chucking a few nukes Iraq's way?


The point you are possibly missing is this: Despite the US's obvious military advantage borne from her huge outlay on defense, her inability to use it responsibly and her lack of foresight and skill in international affairs, means that the American people are LESS secure as a result.

The bottom line is that your government really has no idea.

Poor American taxpayer.

[FooFoo]

Schutzstaffel is right, and I don't think he is "missing the point." U.S policy is imperfect, but nonetheless exhibits qualities of a nation that has shown to take the moral high ground on numerous occassions.

For example, many on this board moan about the bombing of Hiroshima and Nagasaki (although interestingly enough, they aren't Japanese) but fail to grasp the fact that Japan was rebuilt by U.S dollars and is now a wealthy nation. Poor U.S taxpayers indeed, ha!

To go even further, "U.S taxpayers" footed the bill to protect Western Europe from Soviet expansionism for nearly fifty years. Was that money poorly spent? If you think so, then go talk to the Poles, or Hungarians, or Czechs. I think they're pretty damn happy to be in NATO right now.

The U.S spends billions on defense, and rightfully so. Alternative examples of American hegemony can be found in countries like Nazi Germany, Soviet Russia, North Korea, Imperial Japan. Yeah all those are systems I want to live under.

And to bring this to a more topical light, China and Al Qaida. You guys remember China right? You know the government that oppresses Muslims in their western most region. Oh right, you don't hear about those poor souls, because the Chinese would likely shoot any camera crews covering that story.

[Ugly_Truth]

<font color="red">It would be unfortunate if Canada or Mexico lets say goes berzerk and invades US, while most of its troops are stationed overseas.
UT can you give us a breakdown of US troop deployment both domestic and international <!--color-->[/color]

It's on CNN. Watch it. Tells you everything you're asking. I'm already suspicious about Canada. They have their people, military, etc, right on that border. <img src="/threads/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Mexico attacking the UNited States? I think the Texas Rangers can defeat the Mexican Military. I'm talking the baseball team, not the state police. <img src="/threads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Enough smilies.

There are many things you aren't taking into account. First, technological capability vs numbers of troops.

You forget about military reservists, you forget about the national guard.

You forget about the right to bear arms.

You forget about retirees. The state police, the city police. SWAT teams. DEA, NSA, FBI.

And most importantly, you forget about rednecks.

[FooFoo]

Ah yes UT rednecks. I love to read those posts about how "America must be destroyed..blah..blah." Do you mean like invading the U.S?

I would love to see the results of a group of Osama's boys trying to invade the Appalachians. You'd have a million rednecks with deer rifles meeting them. Oh and of course, I doubt they've seen the movie "Deliverance." <img src="/threads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

[theman]

i was using canada and mexico as hypothetical.
but wouldn't it be sad that say someone does invade.. no matter how far fetched that would be... and the whole US military who is primarily in charge of defending the country is absent from domestic positions.

just something to think about.

i don't want to sound competitive but i think the mujahidin in afghanistan are much tougher than american rednecks in the appalachian mountains.

a favorite past time of the afghans is a sport called "buzzkashi" where horsemen compete with each other on who could carry a 100+lb lamb(in one hand) to the goal.

also it was these tough people carried out the war with the russians for 10 years.

and it was these tough people who kicked the british back to india in the late 1800's

American people for the most part are very soft. just look at the slip and fall lawsuits in the courts right now.
and another thing, americans is the fattest country on earth. most obese people in the world. Speaking of the appalachian, when i was on my way to skiing in vermont, i was at a rest stop and a really fat lady storms into the resteraunt and says "If someone doesn't plow the snow i'm going to sue, i fell twice out there", i was giggling inside.. and thought if you weren't so fat you would have better balance and hence not fall(i couldn't help myself). ok ok i'm going off on a tangent, i know some obese people are that way because of medical reasons etc, but i think the gluttonous eating habits of americans attribute to alot of the fatness epidemic.

the majority of the fat rednecks climbing the mountains of the appalachians would be out of breath within half hour.

this doesn't include you UT, i know your a tough guy.

didn't want to continue a my car is faster than yours argument but you started it with your gorilla chest beating.

[Panoramic]

<blockquote><font class="small"><hr />
Oh and of course, I doubt they've seen the movie "Deliverance."

<hr /></blockquote><font class="post">

now that should defeats any argument I may have in the future.

[Dark Angel]

Homeland security. Me and my buddies will take care of America. That's what the National Guard is there for.

So let those Al-qaida scum show up... We'll dish it out to them... US ARMY STYLE!!

[FooFoo]

I have to disagree to a certain extent. Yes there are fat americans, and our way of life is no where near has hard as it was 100 years ago. However, Americans can be a bloodthirsty lot, and when peoples backs are to the wall, you would be surprised how hard people fight.



And also remeber Al Qaida is not made up soley of Afghans. Some guy from, say Egypt, who gets his religious panties in a wad wanders off to Afghanistan to enlist in a training camp is not a hardened fighter.



Sorry, but I'd put my money on a Redneck with dead aim on his own turf versus an equally armed Al Qaida soldier any day of the week.

[WT_Sherman]

The 1994 agreement by a week kneed man who BOUGHT OFF a desperate dictator with a an army twice the size of ours (gee.. what might they need that for?) merely postponed the inevitable. Hvae NO doubt they are on the list. Just yesterday (BBC website) Japan announced their own doctrine of preempting NK as a defensive measure. Only a matter of time they annouce their own nukes as well unless somebody ends this another way. Then what?? Maylasia and Singapore withdraw from the nuclear nonproliferation treaty?

Whack job dictators simply CANNOT be allowed WMD. That day and that SYSTEM of international relations passed away on 9/11.

As far as afghan buzkashi players being tougher than west virgina moonshiners ........... americans are never outgunned. That is the whole point. We will simply never allow it. As I said in 1861, 'war means fighting, and fighting means killing'. We are clear about this in our minds. Hefting around a lamb is of no use when you've been spotted by a 300 lb drone piloted by joystick from 10 miles away, guiding a B-1 into range of a satellite guided bomb.

This may sound harsh, but once one committs to war....